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Heirs of Durin

~ Thorin Oakenshield and Allies

Heirs of Durin

Monthly Archives: April 2012

News: Peter Jackson responds to CinemaCon controversy

27 Friday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ Leave a comment

Tags

48 fps, cinemacon, interview, news, peter jackson

Entertainment Weekly has the first official response from Peter Jackson regarding the negative feedback at CinemaCon this week.

Since the majority of the world was not present to view the 10 minutes of footage, those of us interested in understanding what is so off-putting about the screening have had to imagine what the lucky few at CinemaCon saw.  Much discussion is focused on what is causing the “soap opera” look, which is decidedly not like the Middle-earth we know from LOTR.  I’ll admit Peter Jackson’s response to the criticism does little to convince me that there isn’t something unpleasantly jarring about it.

So far the most useful information comes from a TORn forum member named Owain.  He is a wealth of knowledge about digital film, and has worked with the type of RED Epic cameras that are being used on The Hobbit.  This post contains information that could be key to a better understanding of why the unfinished footage was strange looking to so many people, and it is not just about high frame rates:

“I have been trained by RED Digital Cinema to use the RED Epic. Later this year, I hope to own one… working on it.

Resolution is key, as is bit depth, the wavelet compression that RED RAW files use, how REDCODE RAW files look coming directly out of the camera vs. film etc. etc.

It is true that at these higher resolutions and bit depths the camera can be more unforgiving. But the information that is being captured does allow for manipulation in post that film could never touch. The higher frame rates are providing realistic motion without blurring.

As an editor by trade, I have seen first hand the RAW files that come from the RED camera are they are incredible… so much so that I believe, they (RED) have single handedly revolutionized the world of cinema. They were the first and are arguably the best in D-Cinema.

Peter Jackson is shooting 5K resolution, 16 bit RAW .r3d files (bit depth supplies a massive amount of information for detail) at 5:1 compression at 48fps and higher.

He is oversampling or getting way more information than he needs from his RED Epics.  The reason… the widest latitude possible in post.

When you shoot with a RED camera the RAW data (if properly exposed) actually looks flat. This is purposeful. The key is to properly expose. The RED camera is incredible in low light. The deep dark areas retain all of the detail even with limited to no lighting. This is something film was never really that great at. It is the highlights that DPs have to be careful with.

When taken into the Pablo finishing software, the amount of detail provided by those RED RAW (.r3d files) is virtually limitless.

From my knowledge of the camera and post workflow, I am going to go out on a limb and say that the content at CinemaCon was not meant to give people an accurate view of the final rendering, but to get them used to the idea of the 48fps – strictly from a motion standpoint.

It will be different than what people are used to seeing. It will be better than the fake higher frame rates that tv’s offer. Why? Put simply TVs interpolate or create frames that never existed. They are constructed from algorithms that give you the idea but not the real effect. The frames that will be projected for The Hobbit were actually captured by the cameras and will be projected without any interpolation. So why the negative reactions?

In my opinion:
A. Human nature likes gradual instead of major/abrupt change

B. People had a set of specific expectations going into the screening
C. Ultimately what they saw was not the finished product.”

After reading this, I think there is a good chance we will not be stuck comparing The Hobbit to a soap opera by December.  At least we will get the choice to see it with our own eyes in a number of ways, including in traditional 2D, at 24 fps.  As EW.com announced:

“Despite the criticism at CinemaCon, Jackson and Warner Bros. managed to avoid losing any major support from exhibitors they need to get this format in front of audiences.”

News: Spoilers from The Hobbit

27 Friday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Discussion, Hobbit movie, News

≈ 2 Comments

Tags

bilbo, cinemacon, dwarves, gandalf, hobbit trailer, news, thorin, thrain, TORn

Quickbeam of TORn has posted a very detailed summary of his trip to CinemaCon, and all that can be remembered of the 10 minutes of Hobbit footage, including:

  • The White Council (Saruman, Gandalf, Galadriel and Elrond) discussing the discovery of a Morgul blade
  • Radagast – description of the brown wizard, and his meeting with Gandalf in a crypt
  • “Riddles in the Dark” with Gollum and Bilbo
  • The speaking Trolls and Bilbo’s attempted rescue by the dwarves
  • Gandalf in Dol Guldur with Thráin – brief moment sometime before this scene
  • Legolas threatening Thorin in Mirkwood
  • Tauriel – description of a brief action shot

There are a few more goodies within Quickbeam’s broadcast which were omitted from his write-up.  If you don’t have the inclination to listen to it, they have been summaried here by TORn forum moderator, Silverlode.  It includes details on Gandalf and Galadriel’s “touching” scene.

CinemaCon reveals some surprises for Hobbit fans

25 Wednesday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ 2 Comments

Tags

48 fps, cinemacon, news

During a screening of Hobbit footage yesterday at CinemaCon, attendees got a chance to watch scenes projected at 48 frames per second in 3D, and reactions…well, they weren’t quite what we had been hoping for.  This Entertainment Weekly article does a good job of reminding us that the footage was unfinished, but that this was not the best marketing strategy to convince cinemas to upgrade (check out the second page for actual spoilers from the footage!)  Ain’t it Cool News also describes the difference that finished footage might have made, while Middle-earth News has a list of links to relevant reactions to the screening.

I will be gathering and summarizing all the spoiler-related information (since that’s what is really important anyway) later on.

Luke Evans talks The Raven and The Hobbit

24 Tuesday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ 2 Comments

Tags

bard, luke evans, news, peter jackson

Another good interview at IAmRogue.com with Luke Evans (Bard), mostly about his new film The Raven, but also mentions the positive vibe on The Hobbit set:

“It’s an amazing country. The people are fantastic and I’m working on a job that I will never forget. It’s huge! I’m also working with someone who loves what he does. Peter LOVES what he does! So to be around somebody like that on a daily basis is fantastic and the cast is just a wonderful bunch from all around the world and we’re all here together. We’ve made this our home and it’s really been one of those jobs that you really feel very lucky to have been a part of.”

Read the rest of the article here!

Who Was the Original Owner of Orcrist?

23 Monday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Discussion, Hobbit book, Thorin

≈ 11 Comments

Tags

book of lost tales, ecthelion, elves, essay, orcrist, sword, thorin, weapons

Who Was the Original Owner of Orcrist?
By DanielLB and DarkJackal


After some speculating on TheOneRing.net forums about the history of Orcrist, forum member DanielLB wrote a brief summary of the candidates for the original owner of the sword. I’ve made some slight edits and additions, but the majority are his words:

Beginning with the history of both Glamdring and Orcrist: We know that these swords, which the goblins named Beater and Biter respectively, were “mates” as stated in Fellowship of the Ring. Elrond reveals their origin in The Hobbit:

“These are not troll-make. They are old swords, very old swords of the High Elves of the West, my kin. They were made in Gondolin for the Goblin-wars. They must have come from a dragon’s hoard or goblin plunder, for dragons and goblins destroyed that city many ages ago. This, Thorin, the runes name Orcrist, the Goblin-cleaver in the ancient tongue of Gondolin; it was a famous blade. This, Gandalf, was Glamdring, Foe-hammer that the king of Gondolin once wore. Keep them well!”

The most prominent individuals of Gondolin in the First Age at the time of the Goblin-wars included:

King Turgon (The House of the King) – wielded Glamdring
Assuming Turgon did not carry two large blades, the “mate” of Glamdring was likely borne by another high ranking lord of Gondolin. Therefore, Orcrist could have been in the possession of one of the other ten Leaders of the Houses of Gondolin.
[Note: Some may equate “mate” with “twin”, but there is nothing in the text to prove the two swords looked exactly alike. Alternatively, it could be interpreted that they were created either by the same smith, or by different smiths, but around the same time, or simply that they stayed in close proximity to each other over the centuries. The goblins of the Third Age had an unpleasant tale or two about Beater and Biter, but unless their collective memory goes back all the way to the First Age, we can assume the swords were in use together more recently.]

Last Stand of Turgon, by Belegilgalad

Glorfindel (House of the Golden Flower)
During the Battle of Gondolin, Glorfindel was pulled into an abyss far outside the walls of the city by a balrog, but only after he had mortally stabbed the creature. His body was recovered and laid to rest by the eagle Thorondor, but unless the eagle also recovered his weapon (and not buried it with him), we may assume it was lost.

Glorfindel and the Balrog, by John Howe

Salgant (House of the Harp)
He was the leader of the House of musicians. Salgant died in the Fall of Gondolin, but is known more for his treachery than his valor, and it is unlikely he wielded Orcrist.

“Behind them came the host of the Harp … They were dight with tassels of silver and tassels of gold, and a harp of silver shone in their blazonry upon a field of black.” (Book of Lost Tales II)

Although there are other leaders of the Houses who fought bravely at the Battle of Gondolin, if we assume their weapon of choice (that which Tolkien made a note of) was the only one they bore, then we can quickly rule out a number of the candidates: Continue reading →

A little chat with Conan Stevens

22 Sunday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ 4 Comments

Tags

azog, bolg, conan stevens, interview

So what does it take to be the biggest and the baddest?  Actor and stuntman Conan Stevens gives an exclusive interview with TORn’s Larry D. Curtis.

More on The Hobbit in 48 frames per second

19 Thursday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ 7 Comments

Tags

interview, luke evans, news

Here are some follow up articles about what the film will look like according to a brief interview with Luke Evans (Bard the Bowman), and what type of equipment it will take to convert theaters to the 48 frames per second format.

  • Collider.com: Luke Evans Talks THE HOBBIT and What It’s Like to Shoot at 48 Frames Per Second on the RED EPIC

  • Hollywood Reporter: Peter Jackson’s ‘The Hobbit’ Should Hit Theaters at 48-Per-Second Frame Rate

How will The Hobbit look at 48 frames per second?

16 Monday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Hobbit movie, News

≈ 2 Comments

Tags

48 fps, news

Peter Jackson may be changing the future of film by shooting The Hobbit in 48 fps.  He has assured us it will be an experience unlike anything we have seen before.  But he would say that wouldn’t he?  So how do other people in the profession think of this new technology?  As reported by Variety, the buzz was positive at the SMPTE Summit in Las Vegas this weekend:

The gathering watched camera tests for Warner/New Line’s “The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey,” which tried various frame rates and shutter angles, and was generally impressed at the clarity of the image. “HFR” (and “HRFS” — High Frame Rate Stereoscopic) delivers better results in 3D, cuts down on “judder” and other motion artifacts and generally makes the image appear sharper. The consensus was that the 48 fps 3D images did indeed appear noticeably clearer and more immersive.

Good to know, but will it matter to Hobbit fans if there are no compatible theaters to view the film in this frame rate by this December?

As Warner senior VP of technology Wendy Aylsworth explained, there are 70,000 digital screens worldwide, 40,000 of which are ready for 3D, but exactly zero are capable of showing HFR pics yet. All will need some kind of upgrade, either hardware or software, just to show “The Hobbit” at 48 fps.

Get to work!

Orcrist: The Sword of Thorin in Book, Film, and Replica

10 Tuesday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Discussion, Hobbit book, Hobbit movie, News, Richard Armitage, Thorin

≈ 71 Comments

Tags

dwarves, essay, gandalf, glamdring, news, noble collection, orcrist, replicas, richard armitage, scabbard, sting, sword, thorin, united cutlery, weapons, weta

3/20/14: I have updated this page with new images and information (including where to order replicas), and will continue to do so as more is revealed.  (New info near the bottom of the page).

It is ironic that Thorin Oakenshield’s famous sword was not forged by dwarves at all, but by elves of the First Age, and was originally made for the warriors of Gondolin.  It was called Orcrist, or Orc-cleaver, and though it had fallen into obscurity by the time Thorin found it, the fear it could strike into the hearts of goblins had not waned with age.  They named it Biter, and hated its new owner all the more for bringing it back to the light.

The Great Goblin by John Howe
The Great Goblin, by John Howe

It was discovered, along with two other Gondolin blades, in a troll hoard (the owners having been turned to stone by the cunning of Gandalf).  Gandalf and Thorin were attracted to the weapons “because of their beautiful scabbards and jeweled hilts.”  But neither knew the long pedigree which their swords possessed. Only Elrond was able to identify them with certainty:

“They are old swords, very old swords of the High Elves of the West, my kin. They were made in Gondolin for the Goblin-wars. They must have come from a dragon’s hoard or goblin plunder, for dragons and goblins destroyed that city many ages ago. This, Thorin, the runes name Orcrist, the Goblin-cleaver in the ancient tongue of Gondolin; it was a famous blade. This, Gandalf, was Glamdring, Foe-hammer that the king of Gondolin once wore. Keep them well!” (Tolkien, J.R.R.  The Hobbit.  Boston: Houghton Mifflin, 2007)

With its history partially revealed, Thorin said of Orcrist, “I will keep this sword in honor.  May it soon cleave goblins once again!”

Bilbo also claimed a smaller blade out of the troll’s cache, but not being as flashy as the two swords, it escaped the attentions of all but the hobbit.  Later he would learn that it shared the same properties as Glamdring and Orcrist, in that it glowed with blue fire when enemies were near.

Orcrist would again taste the blood of goblins, though the sword was fated to return to elven hands before beginning its eternal duty protecting the Kingdom under the Mountain.

There is little description given of Orcrist, aside from having a jeweled hilt, being etched with runes, and gleaming “in the dark if foes approached.”  Though not readily apparent, the film version of Orcrist has jewels on the pommel, but much like film Glamdring, it requires a close-up view to see them.  Images of the United Cutlery version reveals the pommel has four stones, both honoring and adding to the book’s description, since these gems are part of the heraldry of Ecthelion of the Fountain [as mentioned in the description of the UC sword further down].  This is in keeping with some educated guesses on who the early owner of Orcrist might have been.

The film version also has runes on the guard which spell O R KH R I S T in Elvish, according to Gwaith-i-Phethdain.

For the overall shape, the designers have chosen a literal interpretation of the name “cleaver”, and styled the blade to reflect this in form and function.  David Stokes explains how a conversation with Weta swordsmith Peter Lyon revealed, “…they went single edged because its the Goblin CLEAVER… so they took that as meaning single edged….”

The average kitchen cleaver has a thick blade with a tough edge, and it relies more on momentum of the cut rather than sharpness, thus reducing possibility of fracture.  Of course, film Orcrist is far more attractive than a butcher’s blade, but it is as cleaver-like as a sword can be while still retaining an elven aesthetic.

Orcrist, as carried by Richard Armitage, who says of the sword, “It’s bloody heavy! But it’s absolutely beautiful to look at.” – Total Film, Aug 2011.

The design is unique, and I have not found an exact real-world match for it yet, but it shares elements of European falchions, and Chinese dao, both of which are single-edged and broad bladed.  There is a wide variety of form even within these weapon groups, but the ones pictured below are the closest I came to the Orcrist shape.

The Conyers Falchion
A Chinese Dao

Like Orcrist, the grip of the dao is often curved (though not in the same direction).

(image source: The Hobbit Annual)

These types of single-edged swords, with a wide distal end, function rather like axes and machetes. While their curving edge makes them good at slashing like a sabre, the acute angle of the blade allows a strike to cut deeper into the target without having to draw the blade across it. Most falchions and dao do have a slight curve to the spine (the falchion pictured above is one of the few surviving examples which does not), while Orcrist is straight along the spine.  Continue reading →

News: The Hobbit Movie Weapon Replicas

10 Tuesday Apr 2012

Posted by D.J. in Discussion, Hobbit movie, News, Thorin

≈ 18 Comments

Tags

axe, bow, dwarves, news, replicas, sword, united cutlery, weapons, weta

July 2012 Updates with new images at the end of the page


A glance at any images from the Hobbit movie gives an idea of the incredible array of weapons that will be employed in the films.  In most shots, the dwarves are bristling with axes, hammers, spears, mattocks, maces, and swords, as well as the odd spoon (Bombur will knock your ass out with that cast-iron ladle) and slingshot (look really close at Ori’s promo pic, and during the scene with the trolls in the trailer).

Dwarves at Rivendell

And we haven’t even seen what the Elves of Mirkwood, or the Men of Dale may wield, or all the goodies hidden in Smaug’s hoard.  Any real collector is probably salivating just thinking about it!  But out of all of this, which items will make it onto the market, and how soon can we expect them?  Continue reading →

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